Amen gillar din artikel idag har männskan dålig eller obefintlig toleransnivo i sverige likadant jag har varit överallt syster världen har förändrats till så långt som NOLLTOLERANS det är detsamma som nacisterna och mina berättade de var i kroatien man fick inte tycka och läsa vad man ville och de som inte var nacister komunister facister fick inte höga attraktiva poster utan fick arbete i fabrik eller i restorantbranschen likadant idag re i europa och amerika vi glömmer fort har kort närminne och långsynta dåliga människor idag om någon är ovanlig menar alla hon e tokig våren 1972 studentrörelsen de välbeställdas var inte länge sedan GUD välsigne dig ta hand om dig och prata inte för mycket och välj vem du har förtroende för bättre umgås i trossamfund där är det normalt funtade / suzana monika göteborg //
I just came to this today. It saddens me so. I am sorry that you, and the little one, and Chuck, had to experience this. I fear such horrors will increase in the near future. I admire your courage in the moment and your reflection then and afterwards. I hope we can all gather courage, give and receive support, and walk the way of the Cross with compassion. Love and healing be with you.
Thank you for your beautiful and consoling words, dear Donna. I came to believe that these screamers also belong to the display on American diversity. still, I wish religion would not be so insulted by them.
Almut, I'm so sorry this happened to you, but I thank you for writing about it. It's horrible and wrong that evil is legal in our country. It has taken me a while to respond because for nearly 30 years we have lived next to a man similar to this preacher who hates us because we are Catholic. The things he has shouted at us and done to us are awful. Our police are useless, sometimes because they are powerless, sometimes because they are as hate filled as our neighbor. So many times over the years I have wondered if we harmed our children by staying here, or if learning to put on the armor of Christ and turn away peacefully is an essential life lesson. So many times I desperately just wanted to move, but for many reasons it never happened. What have I learned? That these shouting men are filled with hate fueled anger and their aim is to pick a fight, which, if you engage, they will twist to blame on their victim. Dialogue is impossible. Support and kind words from others offer us hope. The absence of support at times has taught us to offer hope ourselves when we see a need. Mostly I have learned that my own heart is not immune from flashes of hatred and I have a long way to go.
Eva, thank you for sharing your heart here. I am so sorry to hear that. Having screamers living next door is unbearable. I am so sorry. But who knows what important work you did just by bearing. I have read a beautiful story of a woman who moved next door to a political partisan of the other side. After some strange episodes of passive aggression one walked over asking for help with getting to the hospital. In the car they talked about their lives, not politics. The next week the other came over with some food and so on. Sometimes it is life itself which intervenes. Don't give up. Love to you and your family (and your neighbor) :-)
Thank you, Almut. I have wondered sometimes if the staying put and offerring life the opportunity to intervene is a fruit of the vow of stability. So much to pray about!
Almut: “Forgive them Father, they know not what they do.” I heard of a Saint who said something to the effect that when we forgive people before it even happens…we will find peace and we will not be disturbed. I’m not sure I’d give him due dignity of labeling him as a preacher man as that leaks into those who do have a holy calling and sorta disturbs the peace by lumping them all together. Just because one holds a Bible and one has taken up a role does not classify him as a preacher…pastor…priest. I am sorry you received the verbal assault. He is not worthy of such a title. I like the words of Sister Laureen. She told me she pretends there is a clear plexiglass type window in front of her. And when people come to her and attack…or stir up with words, she will watch the words hit the glass and she follows them down as they slide off. That man with the megaphone is not a product of the former president. His type have been around since the world began. You didn’t miss anything Almut. You saw a corner pocket of people God created who know not what they do. They are in the early stages of transformation is what I like to think. Vengeance is mine says the Lord. Rest assured, He will chastise and perhaps one day, this confused man will grow up and may apologize for what he already knows what it is he has done. My dad always said that the best way to extinguish a behavior is to ignore it. It’s a distraction is what St. Ignatius teaches that Consolation is from Christ. Be consoled. Sometimes I get concerned that by calling him a preacher man, people roll that over to other preachers who are very Christlike. Don’t let that confused person make you confused. Don’t let him holding his Bible taint all Bible holders placing them into the same realm. It divides. We cannot contribute to division. God bless your heart Almut. It is waaaay too big and gentle and peaceful to take on this man’s confusion. It has way more to do with him than you. Love you sister. kk
Kathleen, thank you for your beautiful and important words. Yes, we cannot let the bad apples sour the whole. Thank you for sharing Sr Laureen's image. I indeed felt just like that, like there was a plexiglass glass between me and the screamer and his assault with which he wanted to hurt me, just fell off the glass and ran into the ditch. What a powerful image. Thank you for your kind words, sister!
Almut, I was so sad to read about your experience with the "preacher man". For him to say such things to such a kind, beautiful, and spiritual person was so tragic. Maybe it was similar to the way Christ was treated by some preacher men in his day. My first response to your story was that the man who accosted you was not acting very Christ-like. People like him are not advancing their cause. They turn people away from Christianity, which is also sad. So often people like him are not focused on the teachings of Jesus. I hope it was helpful to you to share this painful experience with us. Bless you.
Thank you, dear friend. It was a tragic experience indeed, but in many ways helped me understand even more the complexity of faith and rage and fear. In the end these preachers add to the diversity of our town square just like everyone else, don’t they? It just took me a while to understand. That does not take from the truth that his heart is misguided and his speech is evil.
This man has none of God. One day he will realize (he will be made to realize) that God loves all. Will he cry out for forgiveness then, or will he shake his fist at heaven and add God to the list of those he hates?
“Dear friends, let us love one another, because love is from God, and everyone who loves has been fathered by God and knows God. The one who does not love does not know God, because God is love.”
I do not think it is possible, except in a therapeutic, pragmatic sense (“forgive or your mental health will suffer”), apart from God helping us, from the inside, so to speak. But here is Corrie Ten Boom relating this story, which is as cogent as anything I could relate:
—————————
It was at a church service in Munich that I saw him, the former S.S. man who had stood guard at the shower room door in the processing center at Ravens-bruck. He was the first of our actual jailers that I had seen since that time. And suddenly it was all there the roomful of mocking men, the heaps of clothing, Betsie's pain-blanched face.
He came up to me as the church was emptying, beaming and bowing. "How grateful I am for your mes-sage, Fraulein." he said. "To think that, as you say, He has washed my sins away!"
His hand was thrust out to shake mine. And I, who had preached so often to the people in Bloemen-daal the need to forgive, kept my hand at my side.
Even as the angry, vengeful thoughts boiled through me, I saw the sin of them. Jesus Christ had died for this man; was I going to ask for more? Lord Jesus, I prayed, forgive me and help me to forgive him.
I tried to smile, I struggled to raise my hand. I could not. I felt nothing, not the slightest spark of warmth or charity. And so again I breathed a silent prayer. Jesus, I cannot forgive him. Give me Your forgiveness.
As I took his hand the most incredible thing happened. From my shoulder along my arm and through my hand a current seemed to pass from me to him, while into my heart sprang a love for this stranger that almost overwhelmed me.
And so I discovered that it is not on our forgiveness any more than on our goodness that the world's healing hinges, but on His. When He tells us to love love itself.
our enemies, He gives, along with the command, the love itself.
I am so sorry. Can confirm these fundamentalists are abusive. My mom compared me to the Nazis for sharing an article with her from MSNBC. I studied the rise of Hitler in German, so that was the end of our relationship. It’s so painful. 💔
I was going to turn away from writing a response; then I realized I would be turning away from sending you love and peace. It took me awhile to really let what happened sink in. My stomach ached and tears flowed as I read your message. I'm sorry you had to experience such an assault. I'm sorry that hurt people hurt people. Thank you for speaking out (to them and to us) with courage and love. Blessings.
Katherine, thank you so much for writing this. It was a sad experience indeed. But then it is probably also a very American experience because what would be the alternative? It would be nice if there were only nice preacher men. But I came to realize after I wrote this piece and read all lovely comments that the screamer guys probably just belong in that display of diversity of that day, too. So that helped me cope. Blessings to you 🙏
This American 1st Amendment, in our Bill of Rights, finds its History in England’s Hyde Park and Speaker’s Corner. ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyde_Park,_London ). As the Church of England developed, other Protestant faiths faced persecution which included the Puritans. Their repression was so bad that they moved to Leyden, but that visit was teaching their children a new culture so they returned to Plymouth, England. There, the persecution increased along with restrictions on speech and faith. So they crossed the North Atlantic in November, 1620 and signed the Mayflower Compact. The treatment shown to religious dissenters in the early 1600s were not forgotten in 1776-1787. Hence our first Amendment Right protects free speech and all forms of worship. Unlike England, no state religion in America. And our slander statutes are quite different from GB.
That Pastor, merely as a gentleman, should have bridled his tongue and followed many of Christ’s “Grace” passages, especially when children & women were present.
NKJV useless wranglings of men of corrupt minds and destitute of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain. From such withdraw yourself. 1 Timothy 6:5
Wow. Thank you for sharing your story. I admit that I began to read this a few days ago, but soon realized that I needed to have the time to REALLY read and absorb it all. I am heartbroken that this has happened to you, especially as we know you aren't the only one. May I keep writing, keep speaking, keep standing up in love for everyone. Take care of you. Your spirit is strong and resilient and wise.
Karen, thank you so much for being here and for reading and for commenting. You say it just beautifully:” May I keep writing, keep speaking, keep standing up in love for everyone.”
I am sad that you and others were treated so poorly. It’s never healthy or helpful to the cause of Christ to behave abusively like this foolish man. BTW, I just found your Substack today. I love what I see so far. My family were from Switzerland originally. I am retired from counseling field but think we have common ground. I’m not sure why American police don’t do more in situations like this. However it’s tragic that churches ever give abusive, hateful people leadership roles. I am afraid some appoint themselves and all they care about is power, control and intimidation. Christ modeled the exact opposite In Philippians 2.
I have some choice (curse) words for this individual running through my head, but I am moved by your compassion in the face of such vitriol. I hate that you had to undergo this experience, but I'm grateful for your sharing it here and inviting conversation and reflection.
Thank you, Mary Jo. Always a good lesson in humility. After writing this piece it just occurred to me that the screamer men just belong also into this wide display of American diversity at a pride fest, don’t they?
Thank you for bringing us this lesson on courage, wisdom, and grace. I am appalled that this happened to you, but sadly, I know it would happen to any of us who might care about and express care for the marginalized and unloved in our communities when they are being subjected to scorn and rage by those who profess to be the keepers of a faith I want nothing to do with. Bless you.
Thank you, Sally, for your kind words. Indeed we need a lot of courage and grace to navigate these difficult times. But there is hope. Blessings to you.
Dear Almut, thank you for sharing this personal, painful, and powerful reflection! Thank you for boldly proclaiming and embodying Jesus when it is costly by confronting someone who presumes to preach Jesus with words and actions that deny Jesus.
Years ago, I had a similar experience when I tried a speak with a street preacher who responded with vitriolic hate and threat.
I have been serving in Mennonite pastoral and peace ministry for over 50 years and am an active contemplative monastic at heart and a Benedictine Oblate with St John's Abbey in Collegeville, MN.
Weldon, thank you for sharing your kind words and experience. Yes, sometimes we just need to retreat as there is no good conversation one can have with abusive men. PS: I am oblate at St Bens 😇
Amen gillar din artikel idag har männskan dålig eller obefintlig toleransnivo i sverige likadant jag har varit överallt syster världen har förändrats till så långt som NOLLTOLERANS det är detsamma som nacisterna och mina berättade de var i kroatien man fick inte tycka och läsa vad man ville och de som inte var nacister komunister facister fick inte höga attraktiva poster utan fick arbete i fabrik eller i restorantbranschen likadant idag re i europa och amerika vi glömmer fort har kort närminne och långsynta dåliga människor idag om någon är ovanlig menar alla hon e tokig våren 1972 studentrörelsen de välbeställdas var inte länge sedan GUD välsigne dig ta hand om dig och prata inte för mycket och välj vem du har förtroende för bättre umgås i trossamfund där är det normalt funtade / suzana monika göteborg //
I just came to this today. It saddens me so. I am sorry that you, and the little one, and Chuck, had to experience this. I fear such horrors will increase in the near future. I admire your courage in the moment and your reflection then and afterwards. I hope we can all gather courage, give and receive support, and walk the way of the Cross with compassion. Love and healing be with you.
Thank you for your beautiful and consoling words, dear Donna. I came to believe that these screamers also belong to the display on American diversity. still, I wish religion would not be so insulted by them.
Almut, I'm so sorry this happened to you, but I thank you for writing about it. It's horrible and wrong that evil is legal in our country. It has taken me a while to respond because for nearly 30 years we have lived next to a man similar to this preacher who hates us because we are Catholic. The things he has shouted at us and done to us are awful. Our police are useless, sometimes because they are powerless, sometimes because they are as hate filled as our neighbor. So many times over the years I have wondered if we harmed our children by staying here, or if learning to put on the armor of Christ and turn away peacefully is an essential life lesson. So many times I desperately just wanted to move, but for many reasons it never happened. What have I learned? That these shouting men are filled with hate fueled anger and their aim is to pick a fight, which, if you engage, they will twist to blame on their victim. Dialogue is impossible. Support and kind words from others offer us hope. The absence of support at times has taught us to offer hope ourselves when we see a need. Mostly I have learned that my own heart is not immune from flashes of hatred and I have a long way to go.
Eva, thank you for sharing your heart here. I am so sorry to hear that. Having screamers living next door is unbearable. I am so sorry. But who knows what important work you did just by bearing. I have read a beautiful story of a woman who moved next door to a political partisan of the other side. After some strange episodes of passive aggression one walked over asking for help with getting to the hospital. In the car they talked about their lives, not politics. The next week the other came over with some food and so on. Sometimes it is life itself which intervenes. Don't give up. Love to you and your family (and your neighbor) :-)
Thank you, Almut. I have wondered sometimes if the staying put and offerring life the opportunity to intervene is a fruit of the vow of stability. So much to pray about!
Almut: “Forgive them Father, they know not what they do.” I heard of a Saint who said something to the effect that when we forgive people before it even happens…we will find peace and we will not be disturbed. I’m not sure I’d give him due dignity of labeling him as a preacher man as that leaks into those who do have a holy calling and sorta disturbs the peace by lumping them all together. Just because one holds a Bible and one has taken up a role does not classify him as a preacher…pastor…priest. I am sorry you received the verbal assault. He is not worthy of such a title. I like the words of Sister Laureen. She told me she pretends there is a clear plexiglass type window in front of her. And when people come to her and attack…or stir up with words, she will watch the words hit the glass and she follows them down as they slide off. That man with the megaphone is not a product of the former president. His type have been around since the world began. You didn’t miss anything Almut. You saw a corner pocket of people God created who know not what they do. They are in the early stages of transformation is what I like to think. Vengeance is mine says the Lord. Rest assured, He will chastise and perhaps one day, this confused man will grow up and may apologize for what he already knows what it is he has done. My dad always said that the best way to extinguish a behavior is to ignore it. It’s a distraction is what St. Ignatius teaches that Consolation is from Christ. Be consoled. Sometimes I get concerned that by calling him a preacher man, people roll that over to other preachers who are very Christlike. Don’t let that confused person make you confused. Don’t let him holding his Bible taint all Bible holders placing them into the same realm. It divides. We cannot contribute to division. God bless your heart Almut. It is waaaay too big and gentle and peaceful to take on this man’s confusion. It has way more to do with him than you. Love you sister. kk
Kathleen, thank you for your beautiful and important words. Yes, we cannot let the bad apples sour the whole. Thank you for sharing Sr Laureen's image. I indeed felt just like that, like there was a plexiglass glass between me and the screamer and his assault with which he wanted to hurt me, just fell off the glass and ran into the ditch. What a powerful image. Thank you for your kind words, sister!
Almut, I was so sad to read about your experience with the "preacher man". For him to say such things to such a kind, beautiful, and spiritual person was so tragic. Maybe it was similar to the way Christ was treated by some preacher men in his day. My first response to your story was that the man who accosted you was not acting very Christ-like. People like him are not advancing their cause. They turn people away from Christianity, which is also sad. So often people like him are not focused on the teachings of Jesus. I hope it was helpful to you to share this painful experience with us. Bless you.
Thank you, dear friend. It was a tragic experience indeed, but in many ways helped me understand even more the complexity of faith and rage and fear. In the end these preachers add to the diversity of our town square just like everyone else, don’t they? It just took me a while to understand. That does not take from the truth that his heart is misguided and his speech is evil.
Do not fall for the police deception, get wise with this podcast:
https://spotifyanchor-web.app.link/e/mt2vktUN9Kb
This man has none of God. One day he will realize (he will be made to realize) that God loves all. Will he cry out for forgiveness then, or will he shake his fist at heaven and add God to the list of those he hates?
“Dear friends, let us love one another, because love is from God, and everyone who loves has been fathered by God and knows God. The one who does not love does not know God, because God is love.”
1 John 4:7–9
Thank you, Kevin, I so often think about this command of neighborly love. Jut how do we apply it on those who do us harm?
I do not think it is possible, except in a therapeutic, pragmatic sense (“forgive or your mental health will suffer”), apart from God helping us, from the inside, so to speak. But here is Corrie Ten Boom relating this story, which is as cogent as anything I could relate:
—————————
It was at a church service in Munich that I saw him, the former S.S. man who had stood guard at the shower room door in the processing center at Ravens-bruck. He was the first of our actual jailers that I had seen since that time. And suddenly it was all there the roomful of mocking men, the heaps of clothing, Betsie's pain-blanched face.
He came up to me as the church was emptying, beaming and bowing. "How grateful I am for your mes-sage, Fraulein." he said. "To think that, as you say, He has washed my sins away!"
His hand was thrust out to shake mine. And I, who had preached so often to the people in Bloemen-daal the need to forgive, kept my hand at my side.
Even as the angry, vengeful thoughts boiled through me, I saw the sin of them. Jesus Christ had died for this man; was I going to ask for more? Lord Jesus, I prayed, forgive me and help me to forgive him.
I tried to smile, I struggled to raise my hand. I could not. I felt nothing, not the slightest spark of warmth or charity. And so again I breathed a silent prayer. Jesus, I cannot forgive him. Give me Your forgiveness.
As I took his hand the most incredible thing happened. From my shoulder along my arm and through my hand a current seemed to pass from me to him, while into my heart sprang a love for this stranger that almost overwhelmed me.
And so I discovered that it is not on our forgiveness any more than on our goodness that the world's healing hinges, but on His. When He tells us to love love itself.
our enemies, He gives, along with the command, the love itself.
Corrie Ten Boom,
The Hiding Place
Thank you for bringing Corrie ten Boom to mind. I read her books, too. Remarkable.
I am so sorry. Can confirm these fundamentalists are abusive. My mom compared me to the Nazis for sharing an article with her from MSNBC. I studied the rise of Hitler in German, so that was the end of our relationship. It’s so painful. 💔
Thank you, Kay, for your sympathy. I am sorry to hear about the rift between your mother and you. Sending warm wishes your way ❤️🩹
I was going to turn away from writing a response; then I realized I would be turning away from sending you love and peace. It took me awhile to really let what happened sink in. My stomach ached and tears flowed as I read your message. I'm sorry you had to experience such an assault. I'm sorry that hurt people hurt people. Thank you for speaking out (to them and to us) with courage and love. Blessings.
Katherine, thank you so much for writing this. It was a sad experience indeed. But then it is probably also a very American experience because what would be the alternative? It would be nice if there were only nice preacher men. But I came to realize after I wrote this piece and read all lovely comments that the screamer guys probably just belong in that display of diversity of that day, too. So that helped me cope. Blessings to you 🙏
This American 1st Amendment, in our Bill of Rights, finds its History in England’s Hyde Park and Speaker’s Corner. ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyde_Park,_London ). As the Church of England developed, other Protestant faiths faced persecution which included the Puritans. Their repression was so bad that they moved to Leyden, but that visit was teaching their children a new culture so they returned to Plymouth, England. There, the persecution increased along with restrictions on speech and faith. So they crossed the North Atlantic in November, 1620 and signed the Mayflower Compact. The treatment shown to religious dissenters in the early 1600s were not forgotten in 1776-1787. Hence our first Amendment Right protects free speech and all forms of worship. Unlike England, no state religion in America. And our slander statutes are quite different from GB.
That Pastor, merely as a gentleman, should have bridled his tongue and followed many of Christ’s “Grace” passages, especially when children & women were present.
NKJV useless wranglings of men of corrupt minds and destitute of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain. From such withdraw yourself. 1 Timothy 6:5
Wow. Thank you for sharing your story. I admit that I began to read this a few days ago, but soon realized that I needed to have the time to REALLY read and absorb it all. I am heartbroken that this has happened to you, especially as we know you aren't the only one. May I keep writing, keep speaking, keep standing up in love for everyone. Take care of you. Your spirit is strong and resilient and wise.
Karen, thank you so much for being here and for reading and for commenting. You say it just beautifully:” May I keep writing, keep speaking, keep standing up in love for everyone.”
I am sad that you and others were treated so poorly. It’s never healthy or helpful to the cause of Christ to behave abusively like this foolish man. BTW, I just found your Substack today. I love what I see so far. My family were from Switzerland originally. I am retired from counseling field but think we have common ground. I’m not sure why American police don’t do more in situations like this. However it’s tragic that churches ever give abusive, hateful people leadership roles. I am afraid some appoint themselves and all they care about is power, control and intimidation. Christ modeled the exact opposite In Philippians 2.
Thank you, Susan, for your kind words and welcome to our Cloister family 😇
I appreciate your words of welcome, Almut!
I have some choice (curse) words for this individual running through my head, but I am moved by your compassion in the face of such vitriol. I hate that you had to undergo this experience, but I'm grateful for your sharing it here and inviting conversation and reflection.
😎🙏
I am so sorry you experienced this hatred.
Thank you, Mary Jo. Always a good lesson in humility. After writing this piece it just occurred to me that the screamer men just belong also into this wide display of American diversity at a pride fest, don’t they?
Thank you for bringing us this lesson on courage, wisdom, and grace. I am appalled that this happened to you, but sadly, I know it would happen to any of us who might care about and express care for the marginalized and unloved in our communities when they are being subjected to scorn and rage by those who profess to be the keepers of a faith I want nothing to do with. Bless you.
Thank you, Sally, for your kind words. Indeed we need a lot of courage and grace to navigate these difficult times. But there is hope. Blessings to you.
Dear Almut, thank you for sharing this personal, painful, and powerful reflection! Thank you for boldly proclaiming and embodying Jesus when it is costly by confronting someone who presumes to preach Jesus with words and actions that deny Jesus.
Years ago, I had a similar experience when I tried a speak with a street preacher who responded with vitriolic hate and threat.
I have been serving in Mennonite pastoral and peace ministry for over 50 years and am an active contemplative monastic at heart and a Benedictine Oblate with St John's Abbey in Collegeville, MN.
Weldon, thank you for sharing your kind words and experience. Yes, sometimes we just need to retreat as there is no good conversation one can have with abusive men. PS: I am oblate at St Bens 😇